Topic: [2F2F]Dodger's bann appeal.

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

* IP address at time of banning: 90.227.163.107.

* Admin who banned you: Snoopy.
   
* Reason given by the admin for your banning: speedhack.
   
*Reason(s) why we should unban you: i never hacked, would never!

[[2F2F]Hellmuth]

wow 

[[MAF]Snoopy]

yeh right...

i was watching you during a SK race and you randomly sped up, a guy called phlip was in your car and when you sped up he was like wtf dodger? at the exact time i seen it

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

IS THAT ALL THE PROOF? :S fuck man! i wouldnt hack! i wanna see a video of this... this is really unfair, i was shortcutting lampposts, so what? i passed iron and daveID, they can clearly back me up i didnt speed away from them :S i dont like this man....

[[MAF]Snoopy]

IS THAT ALL THE PROOF? :S fuck man! i wouldnt hack! i wanna see a video of this... this is really unfair, i was shortcutting lampposts, so what? i passed iron and daveID, they can clearly back me up i didnt speed away from them :S i dont like this man....

a screenshot and a witness is all i have and it's enough!

oh so you know the exact place i am talking about huh? man lol

and actually [FSR]DavID said you was driving strangely too...

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

snoop, come on man? i said i passed them.. :S

[[MAF]Snoopy]

but you know the exact time that i'm talking about you speedhacking when i didn't state it in my post or screenshot

[[FSR]Ush]

 

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

snoop listen! i didnt even speedhax in the first place sooo hoow the heeeck would i even know something at the moment? all i said was: iron and dave can back me up, because i passed them! and they were behind me :S

[[MAF]Snoopy]

snoop listen! i didnt even speedhax in the first place sooo hoow the heeeck would i even know something at the moment? all i said was: iron and dave can back me up, because i passed them! and they were behind me :S

i know what i seen and that phlip guy also said the same, it's clear in the screenshot. and it was the part before you went through the lamp post part, you know which part i'm talking about. funny that because i never mentioned which part i seen you speedhacking you just seem to knew and jeez i wonder how

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

whos phlip then? some random guy? yeah... and that guy said wtf dodger? in middle of alot of turns, how the fuck can i speedhax in turns?


and i passed dave and iron when we reached dust part, WERE I PASSED THEM, and now you say before lamppost turns??? what the fuck, lampposts were before dusty part! and you said i was speedhaxing when i passed them, and i passed them at dust part,

so now i wonder what you mean with "you know exackly where you hacked" been wondering that a while now, since im not even fucking hacking...

[[MAF]Snoopy]

two people seen you speedhacking, one of them being me (i know a hacker when i see one) and a player named phlip that also said ''wtf dodger'' at the exact time as what i saw so i waited until the end of the race to ban you. and a number of other people that also said things were strange with you.

[slowdoh]

What the fuck, I seriously doubt this and where's the video evidence?

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

so wrong man, you clearly DONT know, i didnt hack??? i dont use hack, fuck sake, im getting annoyed now, this is redicilous, do you think this is fun? i didnt even hack, and you sitting here sure as fuck about this, when i didnt even hack??? i dont get shiiiiit man, its like you want me away, and who was the other guy, phlip? :S

[[MAF]Snoopy]

you doubt it because he's 2F2F right? clan members don't have the ability to cheat?

there's two witnesses and a screenshot, didn't have time to record because it happened so quickly

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

Indeed. And since when we have to show a video of speedhacking newb? While dod is regular and I CAN ASSURE you that he didn't hack.
Show me a video evidence and I'll believe you.

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

you didnt record cus there was no speedhacking :/ stop doing this to me, im getting pissed :S

[slowdoh]

Wait till he slips up again then, he is a regular right? So I want to see it in video before I believe anyone

[[MAF]Snoopy]

Indeed. And since when we have to show a video of speedhacking newb?

as i said before, as long as you have a witness and a number of people also noticing the same thing and you don't manage to record then it's enough proof

While dod is regular and I CAN ASSURE you that he didn't hack.

that's total bullshit, understandable that you want to defend your own clan members. but look at the big picture.

how would ever get a video now? he wouldn't be so stupid to do it again..

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

BULLSHIT? the only bullshit here, is YOU blaming ME for SPEEDHACK

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

I would defend anyone from our community. No matter if they're LSR, FSR or SC or whatever.

[[MAF]Snoopy]

BULLSHIT? the only bullshit here, is YOU blaming ME for SPEEDHACK

i know what i seen and many other people did too

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

total bullshit, theres something else in the picture than this bull crap, i didnt fucking hack, whats your problem against me? :S

[[MAF]Snoopy]

nope total clean unedited picture.

many regulars have said they've seen weird stuff from you before, i just happened to randomly spectate you because i was bored, i pm'd phlip to make sure i was right with what i seen.

this doesn't come as a surprise to me because it's all been done before.

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

Name those regulars?

Let's face it. David is not that guy who knows everything about speedhack these days and that phil is totally random guy from nowhere.

[Flopster]

Note to self/community, next time if your banning a regular... record it with fraps so there is no debate/dicussion about it-.. Cant really say anything useful here since i wasn't there.

[[MAF]Sighmoan]

I was in 1st most of that race and was surprised to see Dodger on my arse with my only crashing once in LV.

To be fair, i was concentrating a lot on my driving so wasn't paying a great deal off attention other than seeing ironman behind me for a while, then Dodger.

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

"wierd stuff?" explain. and i dont give shit for that picture, its a random guy who doesent even know the difference of normal speed and a speedhacker.

your ban on me, is that due to boredom too? gotta be.

doesent come as a surprise for you maybe, but for me, racing as usal, all of a sudden i get banned for speedhacking from SNOOP, when i dont even use a single fucking mod on my san andreas, or anything whatsoever. from you i get banned? you say you can see when somebody hack, ppl, dont trust that.

so unfair doing this to me, what the hell did i do to anyone, except for being nice, look at the facts, im skilled racer, but clearly not as skilled as many here, i dont break alot of top records, now... if i would hack, wuldnt i be breaking double as many?

all the facts, i dont even know what points me to speedhack either, this is all false, false, false, false, false!!!

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

Yea I think we all have agreed on that.

[[MAF]Snoopy]

more like you slowdoh and dodger are saying it's a false ban but i know it isn't

phlip? may be a random player but he seen what i seen at the exact moment it happened.

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

i dont wanna fight man, but you accusing me like this is eating my nerves

[slowdoh]

Why didn't you just wait and record if you're so sure, or asked Simon to watch with you? What's the harm in waiting?

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

MM i wonder too

[[MAF]Snoopy]

i did wait. i banned him at the end of the race and i was 100% totally sure. and i clearly wasn't the only one to see it.

[slowdoh]

What phlip? and daveid? Come on, I'm pretty sure most of our admins doubt this or at least expected some sort of proof

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

Who's gonna believe those two? And this screenie is not a video evidence. Maybe you just hate him for some reason, but that doesn't give you a right to ban regulars without recording a video (everyone in this community have to follow the rules, am i right?)

So, I think you should unban him and prove me and the rest of community that he did use that "speedhack".

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

i dont understand you, how can you say youre sure, when i didnt fucking hack, saying your 100% sure, bullshit, cus im 110% sure i DIDNT HACK and you shouldnt be banning innocent players like this, dont you like a good racer racing with you?

[[MAF]Snoopy]

or at least expected some sort of proof

you got your ''some sort of proof''

banned. case closed. i am an experienced admin that knows how to spot a speedhacker. regular clan member or not, you need to see the big picture.

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

This is not closed at all. For god sakes. Where that community shit has gone to?

 Don't you remember that situation with Phil_Ivey? Everyone was saying that he used surface mode but same story, you didn't have any actual proof. And now he's an admin ? So how come that those two who saw him "hacking" become so trustworthy? Come on, don't make this shit.

[[MAF]mooman]

ok 2F2F, even though andy is convinced of dodger's guilt, you're obviously never going to accept that so we thought we'd offer you a deal: we unban dodger and if he ever hacks, 2F2F gets banned from the server for a month.  to make sure you don't kick him out if you notice him hacking, only after a month of him being out of 2F2F will this deal stop working. and to stop you from leaving 2F2F if you notice him hacking, we'll still consider you part of the clan until a month after you've left. and next time there will be a video! so, decide as a clan what choice you want to take and then post here. if you really believe in him so much, it should be an easy decision.

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

mooman4ever, thanks man

[[MAF]Snoopy]

he said 2F2F need to decide as a clan first

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

i know -_- im just showing i appreciate him giving me this chance, this ban shouldnt have been in the first place, your proof is your words and a simple pic, like moo says, video next time or nothing, i hope you remember that!

[[MAF]Snoopy]

i could've said no and you'd be banned forever

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

...for no reason 

[[MAF]Snoopy]

i had a perfectly good reason but you and your clan mates just wouldn't admit to it.

they made it out to be like i'm a new admin around here that doesn't know shit about hacks, of course you won't admit it so we're just going in circles

anyway leave it up to 2F2F now

[[2F2F]Hellmuth]

Guest    11:55:46 PM    Printing the topic "[2F2F]Dodger's bann appeal.".

[[2F2F]DodgeR]

and you think i would admit hack, when i didnt? fuck no. how do you think i feel man? banned for nothing, and all ive heard from you is that i hacked, not fun for shit,

and yes i agree, ima leave it from here.

thank you

[[MAF]MrHess]

Indeed. And since when we have to show a video of speedhacking newb?

as i said before, as long as you have a witness and a number of people also noticing the same thing and you don't manage to record then it's enough proof

heh wish that when I had those ocations I was really heard dude, but no, it never happened. Its very frustrating to catch what you know is a hacker and have all the community against you, but well the desition has been made and now its all up to 2F2F, choose wisely guys. If he really cheated (I always had some doubts about this guy) he will not do it again, be sure of that. A smart cheater never gets caught twice

[[MAF]Snoopy]

Its very frustrating to catch what you know is a hacker and have all the community against you

yeh i understand what you mean now, the whole community pretty much turns against us when they don't agree with a decision.

2F2F members would rather support their clan members rather than their fellow admins and the people that gave them admin status to make a strong name for themselves. that kinda feels like back stabbing to me.

so tbh i don't see them as friends anymore i just see them as admins, they might not care but it's sad to me :/

[[MAF]Vertigo]

Anyone heard of the doctrine of precedent?

Basically, Snoop and Hellmuth were 100% sure Dabar was using mods.
Everyone agreed with them, so he's banned.

Snoop is 100% sure that Dodger hacked. Since the facts of these 2 cases
are very similar (hacks/mods with no hard evidence) the same should go
with Dodger.

So either ban both Dodger and Dabar or don't ban either of them.

[[MAF]falky]

Anyone heard of the doctrine of precedent?

Sadly, a lot of the people that play here aren't college grads yet.

[[MAF]Vertigo]

College grad? It's a simple legal term. It's just that when a decision is made in a case, a similar case in the future must follow the decision in the earlier case.

[[MAF]Sighmoan]

Anyone heard of the doctrine of precedent?

Basically, Snoop and Hellmuth were 100% sure Dabar was using mods.
Everyone agreed with them, so he's banned.

Snoop is 100% sure that Dodger hacked. Since the facts of these 2 cases
are very similar (hacks/mods with no hard evidence) the same should go
with Dodger.

So either ban both Dodger and Dabar or don't ban either of them.

Excellent post, and good point well made.

And moo, that is a great offer, well thought out.

[[2F2F]SNiKeRiS]

We agree with you and your offered deal rules, moo. Thanks for understanding.

[[MAF]mooman]

Unbanned!